tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1228690739485734684.post402052566860595899..comments2024-03-28T22:13:17.139+00:00Comments on Stonehenge and the Ice Age: Newall's MoundBRIAN JOHNhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00413447032454568083noreply@blogger.comBlogger22125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1228690739485734684.post-46521316293569156572012-11-16T18:08:41.780+00:002012-11-16T18:08:41.780+00:00There is a brief summary of Mike Allen's findi...There is a brief summary of Mike Allen's findings in the Stonehenge Landscape as a whole [as part of the MPP-ed SRP], at Dennis Price's blogsite:-<br /><br />http://www.eternalidol.com/?p=7267<br /><br />under the heading "Stonehenge & Avebury seminar at Devizes" [submitted by the late Alex Down]TonyHnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1228690739485734684.post-2222348920239787492012-11-13T18:36:45.015+00:002012-11-13T18:36:45.015+00:00Well, there are lots of little hummocks in this ph...Well, there are lots of little hummocks in this photo -- many of them might relate to the presence of molehills. But the larger features, like the bank running across the avenue, are probably caused by natural processes as yet undetermined...BRIAN JOHNhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00413447032454568083noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1228690739485734684.post-89767868081630410902012-11-13T04:31:51.088+00:002012-11-13T04:31:51.088+00:00Brian,(responding to your comment on 12 November 2...Brian,(responding to your comment on 12 November 2012 08:24)<br /><br />I do and have done some googling before posting. But I failed to use the Search in your blog! My bad! You are right! You have lots on 'clay-with-flints'! Clearly you are as intriqued by this as I am! <br /><br />In one of your posts (“Clay-with-flints and Chalky till” on Dec. 7, 2009) you quote from the same wiki article I read! <br /><br /><i>“... Clay-with-Flints is developed over an area which is just beyond the limits of the ice sheets of the Glacial epoch, ... heavy rain, snow and frost, may have had much to do with the mingling...”</i><br /><br />Clearly, the mingling of clay and flint involved water. The question is how? Meltwater streams, perhaps?<br /><br />KostasAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1228690739485734684.post-19158847501489854512012-11-12T16:30:33.511+00:002012-11-12T16:30:33.511+00:00Pages 3 and 4 (Geology) of the E.H. report also ta...Pages 3 and 4 (Geology) of the E.H. report also talk about the structure and possible formation of the Mound.TonyHnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1228690739485734684.post-27223834106943407672012-11-12T16:12:03.154+00:002012-11-12T16:12:03.154+00:00Just a point of information: David Field (who help...Just a point of information: David Field (who helped write the Avenue Reserch Paper Tim has just mentioned) retired from English Heritage's Swindon office in 2012. He is an active member of WANHS's Archaeological Field Group based at Devizes.TonyHnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1228690739485734684.post-85808040802933149712012-11-12T13:18:07.086+00:002012-11-12T13:18:07.086+00:00Pages 35-36 of the report do provide an alternati...Pages 35-36 of the report do provide an alternative view to that in the MPP book i.e "part of a field boundary lynchet..." Geocurnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1228690739485734684.post-11078128467052450602012-11-12T12:46:05.164+00:002012-11-12T12:46:05.164+00:00Thank you Tim -- that's a very useful referenc...Thank you Tim -- that's a very useful reference. The text isn't terribly enlightening -- but we can see Newall's Mound at point (g) on Fig 12, very close to the "elbow' in the Avenue. From the report it is obvious that there are many micro-features across this area -- some man-made and others natural.BRIAN JOHNhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00413447032454568083noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1228690739485734684.post-81210204280765351652012-11-12T11:40:38.678+00:002012-11-12T11:40:38.678+00:00EH published a Research Paper on The Avenue which ...EH published a Research Paper on The Avenue which discusses the Mound in some detail - http://services.english-heritage.org.uk/ResearchReportsPdfs/031_2012WEB.pdf<br /><br />EH don't seem to tell anyone about their research papers which no one knows about them. I have tried to create a full list of the online Stonehenge ones at http://www.sarsen.org/2012/11/english-heritage-2012-research-reports.htmlTim Dawhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10667360714222841797noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1228690739485734684.post-15448198515470865692012-11-12T08:24:49.733+00:002012-11-12T08:24:49.733+00:00Kostas -- I have asked you many times before to re...Kostas -- I have asked you many times before to read before you post, and to show some willingness to do your own research. I already have masses of info on my blog about clay-with-flints. Just use the search facility on the site -- it works well! As far as locations are concerned, I cannot add a map with every post -- and if you are uncertain about a location, just ask Google..... I do have lots of maps on the site already, associated with various posts.BRIAN JOHNhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00413447032454568083noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1228690739485734684.post-81145016771112313662012-11-12T00:47:44.793+00:002012-11-12T00:47:44.793+00:00Brian,
A question and a favor, if you please.
As...Brian,<br /><br />A question and a favor, if you please.<br /><br />As a geomorphologist and geologist, what sense do you make of the “clay-mixed-with-flint” phenomenon? How does this come about and what does it tell us about the landscape?<br /><br />For those of us not as familiar with your backyard areas and the backwoods regions of the UK, could you please include a “map with a dot” indicating the locations of the places you post on?<br /><br />Thanks,<br /><br />KostasAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1228690739485734684.post-74646826546769304462012-11-11T22:09:00.632+00:002012-11-11T22:09:00.632+00:00John "snail " Evans was by all accounts ... John "snail " Evans was by all accounts quite a character ,one story I heard recently still has me smiling thinking about it ,not repeatable on a family web site , more rock n' roll than malacology .<br />Mpp has a wee hint in the recent book but that was relatively tame .Geocurnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1228690739485734684.post-59721965508611666562012-11-11T21:29:37.238+00:002012-11-11T21:29:37.238+00:00Going back to the Sept. 2012 Antiquaries Journal a...Going back to the Sept. 2012 Antiquaries Journal article, go to:-<br /><br />http://journals.cambridge.org/action/display Abstract?fromPage=online&aid=8698761<br /><br />There is an abstract there which fails to mention Newall's Mound. I must have walked pretty close to it, but was insufficiently observant to take in its possible glacial significance.<br /><br />Charles French's Cambridge & Email addresses are displayed;also Mike Allen's and other contributors. There is a person called Scaife from Southampton University's Geography Dept who might be worth contacting with regard to the missing geomorphological research.TonyHnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1228690739485734684.post-21244589032101213642012-11-11T21:11:19.687+00:002012-11-11T21:11:19.687+00:00The word "geomorphology" occurs only onc...The word "geomorphology" occurs only once, as far as I've managed to discover, in the WHOLE of MPP's book. He uses it to describe the re-use of what he terms a natural feature at Durrington Walls henge as a "freak of geomorphology".<br /><br />There, the Neolithic avenue or 'road', consisting of rammed flint constructed on top of "an entirely natural surface of exposed flint fragments that had formed in the bottom of of the dry valley or coombe that ran from the Southern [wooden] Circle to the River Avon.<br /><br />Parker Pearson then goes on to ask whether a similar natural coincidence [viz. the periglacial stripes leading away from the Heel Stone} could have also dictated the placing of Stonehenge.<br /><br />But just one use of the noun geomorphology does tend to beg the question, wouldn't a professional Geomorphologist have been a useful to your multi-disciplinary SRP team, Mr Pearson? And it's not too late to remedy that.<br /><br />Maybe we should all write to the National Geographic, one of his primary sponsors, and point out his [and therefore by association their] glaring ommission of one of the main skills of the all-round Geographer, that obtained from geomorphological training. TonyHnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1228690739485734684.post-12775500929356365382012-11-11T20:51:22.688+00:002012-11-11T20:51:22.688+00:00Thanks, Geo. Mike PP, incidentally, refers to Prof...Thanks, Geo. Mike PP, incidentally, refers to Professor John Evans as 'snail Evans', to distinguish him from lots of other archaeological Evanses, as he "became the leading specialist in land molluscs" (page 239).TonyHnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1228690739485734684.post-43654801287204028632012-11-11T16:18:08.019+00:002012-11-11T16:18:08.019+00:00Fwiw. The recent Antiquaries Journal paper is most... Fwiw. The recent Antiquaries Journal paper is mostly concerned with sediment , palaeosols , pollen and mulluscan .No mention of Newall's Mound .for the avenue the profile = prs 50-52 .paleosol type turf and rendzina ,and truncated rendzina , mollucan data = open grassland and interpreation =thin calcareous grassland soils ,truncated by the removal of turf ,pre 2000 cal bc .Geocurnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1228690739485734684.post-82643925977890791112012-11-11T13:40:22.516+00:002012-11-11T13:40:22.516+00:00A check via the Search Engine has revealed for me:...A check via the Search Engine has revealed for me:-<br /><br />ANTIQUARIES JOURNAL, September 2012 Article by (amongst others) Mike Allen and Charly French [also MPP, etc, etc]:-<br /><br />Durrington Walls to West Amesbury by way of Stonehenge: a major transformation of the Holocene landscape.<br /><br />Perhaps Myris of Alexandria may be able to conjure up the text or the guts of this article? I believe he may have connections with the required SALON.<br /><br />Allen is listed as Visiting Fellow at Bournemoth University; he also runs his own Environmental Archaeology consultants company.TonyHnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1228690739485734684.post-83280599907251464832012-11-11T12:22:43.830+00:002012-11-11T12:22:43.830+00:00Moles No they don't!!
Bits of tat for the G......Moles No they don't!!<br />Bits of tat for the G......s<br />MMyris of Alexandrianoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1228690739485734684.post-11569010068266703882012-11-11T00:37:44.493+00:002012-11-11T00:37:44.493+00:00"Note that there are a lot of surface undulat..."Note that there are a lot of surface undulations..... how were they made?"<br /><br />Moles, they do kick up a lot of interesting stone pieces!<br /><br />PeteGAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1228690739485734684.post-53378757754506285232012-11-10T23:29:57.994+00:002012-11-10T23:29:57.994+00:00Brian,
If the Newall's Mount is at the end of...Brian,<br /><br />If the Newall's Mount is at the end of the Avenue Elbow, as you believe, this 'clay-with-flints' earth mount sitting on top of a 'solution hollow' supports my working hypothesis the Avenue was an egress meltwater stream for the retaining basin I speculate existed at Stonehenge and draining at River Avon. <br /><br />KostasConstantinos Ragazasnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1228690739485734684.post-7300413547270146632012-11-10T22:26:39.475+00:002012-11-10T22:26:39.475+00:00I used to see John Evans occasionally at conferenc...I used to see John Evans occasionally at conferences -- and he had a nice little cottage at Aber Bach. He knew his stuff, but he was not a geomorphologist....BRIAN JOHNhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00413447032454568083noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1228690739485734684.post-35845345327768683492012-11-10T20:04:51.104+00:002012-11-10T20:04:51.104+00:00"Did John Evans ever publish his research?&qu..."Did John Evans ever publish his research?" Perhaps he did. Newall's mound featured in his lecture slides (page 243). And on page 239, Parker Pearson talks about how two of Atkinson's trenches, dug in 1978, had been properly recorded, and even published, by Evans. Newall's Mound was cut into in 1978 by Atkinson and Evans. We are then referred to "Evans 1984" in the bibliography. This is, as you will see, Brian, a reference to a WANHS Magazine article, "Stonehenge - the environment in the Late Neolithic and Early Bronze Age and a Beaker-Age burial". WANHS Magazine, 78, 1984, 7-30.TonyHnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1228690739485734684.post-43689065685807133252012-11-10T19:50:27.758+00:002012-11-10T19:50:27.758+00:00There are other aspects of Parker Pearson's re...There are other aspects of Parker Pearson's report of the so-called Newall's Mound in his recent book that I find of great interest. We may call this The Welsh Connection (though no, this time it isn't with the Preseli Hills this time!).<br /><br />It emerges from Parker Pearson's statements that his colleagues on the Stonehenge Riverside Project's work at The Avenue, Messrs French & Allen, were both students of Welshman John Evans, presumably at Cardiff University, where, we are told elsewhere, Evans was Professor of Environmental Archaeology (Richard Atkinson was also at Cardiff of course.) MPP says "Here was a textbook example of a geological feature of the sort John loved" and "Mike Allen and Charly French were delighted to see the re-excavated solution hole. Both had been John's students and knew it well from his lecture slides."TonyHnoreply@blogger.com